62 replies to this topic

[mim]

True, whether shes crazy or not she deserves punishment, but if she really IS crazy then life in prison will due, not capital punishment.

[Wicked]

Thats awful... Sick and awful.... If she does get life then I'm going to be ticked.

[Sakura]

I was going to post that she'd try and probably should get that plea, but I don't know how hard it is in America to get that plea.
It actually does kind of irritate the hell out of me when people go saying, oh she should die, she's disgusting, and so on. Consider this: She may not have known she was pregnant, it's getting more and more common for woman to find out only a few hours before their child is born that they're pregnant.
Not everyone misses their period during pregnancy or put it down to stress, not everyone gets morning sickness or puts on much weight, and if she's 'large and heavyset' it'd be even harder if all the above happened.
Ok so, she's just found out she's in labour, she's in extreme pain, hormones going all over the place, eventually she gives birth and doesn't know what to do. All of the above lead her to think she has no options and that she should erase that child from existance so everything will go back to the way it was. Harsh, but to her, it's the only option she can think of, she may not have known about the Safe Haven option... America isn't well known for its sexual health education. And from there she kills the baby and disposes of it.
The fact that she stabbed her 135 times would actually help the psychosis plea, if she simply wanted to kill the child, a few stabs would do it, and dumping of the child would end any possibility of it surviving.

I far from condone what she did, but she deserves not to be treated like an animal. To be honest, some of your responses digust me more than what she did.

I've been pregnant. If you don't know that you are, you're either high 24/7 or the dumbest pile of shit in the world.

SHE is 17 goddamn years old, not some stupid 11 year old. She knew to go into a seperate room with a towel and a knife. It took planning to think about getting that knife, whether it be to cut the umbilical cord or to kill the baby, she had to have been perfectly rational to think of that. No, people should not get off just because they did something stupid, that's all this insanity plea adds up to. It takes evil to do this to a child. As far as I'm concerned, she is an animal.

[Wicked]

Firstly, when topics annoy me, I tend to write long posts, back up what I say and am blunt. Anyway,

Here's where I'm coming from in terms of the law here. I don't know American law, nor care actually.

I guess it depends what you mean by liable. Did she cause the death of her child? Yes, did she murder her child. Maybe, maybe not, it depends what kind of lawyer she gets.

Sakura, I know there would be a few people out there who're stupid enough not to realise, but also there are a lot of people that have very few symptoms, some don't have any. There's been a few cases in the media recently of intelligent people who find out only hours before they have their child that they were pregnant for the last 9 months. Not a single sign shows of the pregnancy... just because personally you found it obvious, it's not always (I'm not saying this is common, it's quite rare but it is something to be considered is all I was trying to point out since most posters made very quick unfair judgement calls, based on ignorance). I'm sure you would have been irritated by anyone you knew who boasted about not having morning sickness at all, or mentioned they never felt their baby kick, or didn't put on much weight...and so on.

I do have to agree with kitsune there. My friend's cousin went to the hospital one day because her lower back was hurting her badly. She had just gotten married and had her regular periods, but still she was pregnant all the same. She had no clue and she didn't show any signs of being pregnant. Talk about surprise.

[flooble]

That must have been some autopsy. As most people here have said, how the heck did they count 135 wounds? I mean, a range of '100 to 150' would have been more realistic.

And about the stabbing... O.O

[ascend]

Well, I guess they can count it by the amount of times the sharp mark the the knife or w/e appears on the bones when stabbed. Like they count the dents in the bones. If you ever try stabbing a wooden desk with a knife, it'll make a mark. That's what they count, I think. Must have looked like swiss cheese..

But, do you realize how much time it would have taken to stab 135 times? Assuming they make one stab every second... That's over 2 minutes of stabbing . Yeah.. She's crazy.

[Tetiel]

Kitsune, part of the thing is Americans are very educated about these things and I have from the time I was a preteen known about the baby programs. It's irresponsibility on her part. Stabbing a child I would think is pretty much drilled into our minds as never an alternative to adoption. It's just... christ... I would have no problem with her getting an extremely long sentence. I don't believe a death sentence is okay as we're only saying that as it's a baby (if it were an adult not as many would cry out for that) however... she needs to be excessively punished.

[Wicked]

Kitsune, part of the thing is Americans are very educated about these things and I have from the time I was a preteen known about the baby programs. It's irresponsibility on her part. Stabbing a child I would think is pretty much drilled into our minds as never an alternative to adoption. It's just... christ... I would have no problem with her getting an extremely long sentence. I don't believe a death sentence is okay as we're only saying that as it's a baby (if it were an adult not as many would cry out for that) however... she needs to be excessively punished.

seriously.... That poor baby didn't even get a chance in this world... People who do this just make me sick...

[Jewbert]

seriously.... That poor baby didn't even get a chance in this world... People who do this just make me sick...

Hm. I wouldn't want to bring ANYthing into this disgusting world....

[Wicked]

Hm. I wouldn't want to bring ANYthing into this disgusting world....

Still she brought it in this world in the first place. The baby was born, then killed. I would at least let it live life first. Adoption anyone?

[Jewbert]

Still she brought it in this world in the first place. The baby was born, then killed. I would at least let it live life first. Adoption anyone?

I know. I'm not saying that I would kill something too. It SHOULD have been put up for adoption.

[Bão]

I wonder how 135 different stab marks were counted on something so small.

How do you even go about stabbing your own newborn that many times?

[ArchAngel.]

:X
That's really screwed up...
She's going to get off scott free though...
I think it's called post-pardum depression or something like that.
So yeah, insanity's got her back. -.-

[Wicked]

:X
That's really screwed up...
She's going to get off scott free though...
I think it's called post-pardum depression or something like that.
So yeah, insanity's got her back. -.-

Yeah that is the depressing part. Gah i hate our legal system sometimes.

[Tetiel]

Nononono, I told you guys... she won't get off for it. Only 1% of the people who plea insanity actually are deemed insane. It is VERY VERY hard to be defined insane. You have to be unaware of what the legal system is altogether. There was even a case of a paranoid schizophrenic who was tried and convicted despite his lawyer's plea because the crime was proven premeditated (even though the voices told him to do it -_-). Of course the man committed suicide in jail so he should have been convicted... But anyways it really is that hard to do.

[Fatal]

thats pretty crazy, im guessing different boyfriend when she got pregnant than whats on her myspace?

[Ives]

Still digging cynicism, eh?

[Christopher Robin]

A life for a life, that's the way I see it.

She took a life, now she has to pay the price. The price should be her own life. None of this life in prison crap.

Coming from the guy who thinks that war is crazy, and that we shouldn't try to fight terrorism?

[illicit]

That's horrible... my cousin just had a baby, and I got to hold her today, I couldn't imagine why anyone would/could harm something so innocent... disgusting.

[Christopher Robin]

HARM it? They mutilated it! After 135 stabs, the body was more than likely falling apart, with bits fallen off... Disgusting. Although, I don't know what's wrong with the nikki person...

[pktester]

Nononono, I told you guys... she won't get off for it. Only 1% of the people who plea insanity actually are deemed insane. It is VERY VERY hard to be defined insane. You have to be unaware of what the legal system is altogether. There was even a case of a paranoid schizophrenic who was tried and convicted despite his lawyer's plea because the crime was proven premeditated (even though the voices told him to do it -_-). Of course the man committed suicide in jail so he should have been convicted... But anyways it really is that hard to do.

Ok, first of all I do not think you know much about the U.S. Legal system. I'm currently in undergrand but have taken by far more legal classes than most people, as I am planning to be an attorney. I can tell you, that there is a VERY HIGH chance this girl will get off relatively free. You also, have your 1% wrong. The stat is that only 1% or less (With a an average stat of .26 percent) of people TRY for the insanity defense.

The insanity defense can be difficult to pull, however her case is different. Further more, she would most likely be convicted of VOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER, even though the case involved a child. Under federstatues, which states do not normall differ from very much:

" Whoever is guilty of involuntary manslaughter, shall be fined
under this title or imprisoned not more than six years, or both."

So, again, I'm not exactly sure why she would spend life in jail anyhow. The difference between first degree murder, second degree murder, is the whole heat of passion declaration. Which, I think any jury, would reasonably say that this murder was committed in the heat of the moment after giving birth.

Even if she doesn't get the insanity plea, I still do not see how she is going to get such a harsh penalty.

Tetiel, I feel like you need to reasearch some Laws, along with State and Federal statutes before you can say with such certainty what you have been saying.

Oh and if anyone doubts my findings, I will be more than willing to give you revised code numbers, along with some cases for example :-)

[Tetiel]

Ok, first of all I do not think you know much about the U.S. Legal system. I'm currently in undergrand but have taken by far more legal classes than most people, as I am planning to be an attorney. I can tell you, that there is a VERY HIGH chance this girl will get off relatively free. You also, have your 1% wrong. The stat is that only 1% or less (With a an average stat of .26 percent) of people TRY for the insanity defense.

The insanity defense can be difficult to pull, however her case is different. Further more, she would most likely be convicted of VOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER, even though the case involved a child. Under federstatues, which states do not normall differ from very much:

" Whoever is guilty of involuntary manslaughter, shall be fined
under this title or imprisoned not more than six years, or both."

So, again, I'm not exactly sure why she would spend life in jail anyhow. The difference between first degree murder, second degree murder, is the whole heat of passion declaration. Which, I think any jury, would reasonably say that this murder was committed in the heat of the moment after giving birth.

Even if she doesn't get the insanity plea, I still do not see how she is going to get such a harsh penalty.

Tetiel, I feel like you need to reasearch some Laws, along with State and Federal statutes before you can say with such certainty what you have been saying.

Oh and if anyone doubts my findings, I will be more than willing to give you revised code numbers, along with some cases for example :-)

Do you have to be such a douche about a statistical error? I was quoting a video we were watching in one of my Psych classes about a case of a paranoid schizophrenic. Perhaps I heard wrong and if I did, I apologize but I heard it not much more than about a week ago.

[414de7fe6]

Regardless of what defense she tries and how she does it, she is still liable for that baby's life and needs to have her own life right removed as the consequence. Insanity or none, it is -murder-, and murder should be punishable by death in almost every case.

[Tetiel]

Oh yes and if anyone cares...
http://www.twincitie...?nclick_check=1
She's being tried with first degree murder and held at $1 million bail.

[414de7fe6]

lol I'm surprised you can actually be that wrong and not know it Euphoria But then you've never been known for your open-mindedness

Nice job at deleting my first post about this, now let me phrase it again.

What exactly gives you the right to tell me I'm wrong?