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Do you believe in god?


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#1051 artificial

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 02:36 AM

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar%2FFatwaE%2FFatwaEAskTheScholar&cid=1119503543362#ixzz0wK0IboYW


This irks me. In fact, I've posted similar topics on Christian forums. It was responses like those that turned me off religion in the first place.

It annoys me that, when presented with somewhat controversial versus, rather than addressing their infallibility, people quote contradictory passages that are meant to supersede the meaning of those brought in to question. What kind of methodology is that? The expert answers you supplied don't actually answer anything; rather, they create a contradiction. Religious texts are full of them, and yet you can't challenge them, because it's all semantics: our personal interpretation of divine meaning.

Religion is a fascinating concept. It's amazing the influence a single book can have on the world.

#1052 Sweeney

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 02:40 AM

It's amazing the influence a single book can have on the world.

Just look at Harry Potter!

#1053 artificial

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 02:49 AM

Just look at Harry Potter!


Thankfully it's influence is somewhat minimal down under. Though having said that, there's always one kid rocking up to the premiere draped in wizard's attire. How a set of books written so terribly have captivated so many is beyond me :(

#1054 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 02:58 AM

Just look at Harry Potter!




Sweeeney.... Come out and Play.... I want you to tell all these nice people why you been ducking me. eh ? Why don't you find an excuse or argument that counters what i have said?


#1055 Sweeney

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:02 AM


Sweeeney.... Come out and Play.... I want you to tell all these nice people why you been ducking me. eh ? Why don't you find an excuse or argument that counters what i have said?

I didn't read your post.
Chances are that you're just here to troll for Allah, since your only posts in this entire forum are here, so I'm sorry, but I'm not interested.

#1056 artificial

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:05 AM

Now what makes you discriminative you ask? The simple fact that you agree with science until science agrees that there is a creator/god. Once science makes the agreement, Lo and behold you aren't friends with Science anymore.... How about that? Am i right? Am i right? Okay i'll give you an easy example for your simple minds.


Lo and behold! My guess is you attended a hick school down south with priests for science teachers.

Your post is crap. No wonder he decided to ignore it.

#1057 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:11 AM

I didn't read your post.
Chances are that you're just here to troll for Allah, since your only posts in this entire forum are here, so I'm sorry, but I'm not interested.


I'm a troll? hahah. No way. If you bothered to actually read what I said, there was much logic in it. Your bashing religion and comparing it to Harry Potter? You haven't said one intelligent thing in this whole topic....... and you call me a troll? No dude. I am no troll. I just want an honest answer from you. If you believe in the science that proves you have a brain or how your body works, why do you choose to disbelieve the science in religion? Are you ignorant? Or just Arrogant?


Give me an honest reply. No jokes. I won't make fun of you for it.


By the way, what does me not posting ever, have to do with a troll?





----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lo and behold! My guess is you attended a hick school down south with priests for science teachers.

Your post is crap. No wonder he decided to ignore it.



Who's talking to you? I am addressing your atheist friend here, who contradicts everything he says and is a walking contradiction. After I'm done with him, your next.

Edited by Finale, 12 August 2010 - 03:13 AM.


#1058 Waser Lave

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:13 AM

Lo and behold! My guess is you attended a hick school down south with priests for science teachers.

Your post is crap. No wonder he decided to ignore it.


Both TigerWoods and Finale are in Canada and the same city apparently (although different IPs) so it looks like he got one of his friends to try to back him up. :p

#1059 Sweeney

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:17 AM

If you believe in the science that proves you have a brain or how your body works, why do you choose to disbelieve the science in religion?

Tell you what.
Show me one peice of science that backs up the bible, or the koran, and I'll either convert on the spot, or show you how it's full of shit.
Actually, to clarify further, I'm talking about miraculous claims, or claims of divine knowledge. No trivialities here, please.

Don't worry, I'll type in very short words.

#1060 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:19 AM

Both TigerWoods and Finale are in Canada and the same city apparently (although different IPs) so it looks like he got one of his friends to try to back him up. :p


Oh snap. Tiger we have been figured out. One of their Low life friends did a search on his pokedex, and has figured out that we live in the same city. Oh Snap.
What does me and him living in the same city have to do with friendship?

Wouldn't you call it a coincidence since your atheist? Oh wait.... maybe it happened for a reason. Maybe he called me, to show me what atheists are like?


But really? Doesn't it make sense that something happens for a reason..... and not a coincidence? LOL ... cuz c'mon right now...your like naw man this can't be a coincidence.

#1061 TigerWoods

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:24 AM

Oh snap. Tiger we have been figured out. One of their Low life friends did a search on his pokedex, and has figured out that we live in the same city. Oh Snap.
What does me and him living in the same city have to do with friendship?

Wouldn't you call it a coincidence since your atheist? Oh wait.... maybe it happened for a reason. Maybe he called me, to show me what atheists are like?


But really? Doesn't it make sense that something happens for a reason..... and not a coincidence? LOL ... cuz c'mon right now...your like naw man this can't be a coincidence.


:unsure: did anyone even look at those Pharaoh verses at least?

#1062 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:26 AM

Tell you what.
Show me one peice of science that backs up the bible, or the koran, and I'll either convert on the spot, or show you how it's full of shit.
Actually, to clarify further, I'm talking about miraculous claims, or claims of divine knowledge. No trivialities here, please.

Don't worry, I'll type in very short words.




Alright lets do this Sweeney.

First of all, answer me these questions:

1. Do you believe in Science?
2. Have you seen your Brain? If not, How do you know you have a brain if you haven't ever seen it?
3. What is the difference between the science you believe in, and the science in the holy quran? (excluding God for this statement. Meaning nothing to do with god, just science.)
4. Were there scientists on the earth 1400 years ago, and was there advanced technology?
5. You take a bio test from a teacher, she gives you time, but you don't study the material? Who's fault is it, you or the teacher? (providing she gave you the right material and plenty of time.)




Answer these questions for me in any order you want. Just make sure you answer them. And this is only to you. Not dragon or anyone else.

#1063 Waser Lave

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:28 AM

Oh snap. Tiger we have been figured out. One of their Low life friends did a search on his pokedex, and has figured out that we live in the same city. Oh Snap.
What does me and him living in the same city have to do with friendship?

Wouldn't you call it a coincidence since your atheist? Oh wait.... maybe it happened for a reason. Maybe he called me, to show me what atheists are like?


But really? Doesn't it make sense that something happens for a reason..... and not a coincidence? LOL ... cuz c'mon right now...your like naw man this can't be a coincidence.


What makes you think that I like Pokemon and that I'm an atheist? I don't recall having discussions about either of those topics with you.

#1064 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:33 AM

What makes you think that I like Pokemon and that I'm an atheist? I don't recall having discussions about either of those topics with you.


C'mon dude. It's clear your the lookout for the enemies hahaha. Both Finale and Tiger are in the same city guys! Lets get them!



LOL oh and i heard of an old saying.... you are who you walk with. I have been keep a close eye on this forum, and i find it to be 90% atheist, except for the occasional 1 christian and 1 agnostic who's senstive.

but no really Waser Lave... that was so funny. Like the way you said it... guys its the enemy! They are working together ! Posted Image


If you are not an atheist I do apologize. Posted Image

#1065 Waser Lave

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:35 AM

For the record, I do not like Pokemon.

#1066 artificial

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:37 AM

Why was your post directed only at Sweeney :(

It deserves to be ripped apart non-exclusively!

#1067 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:42 AM

Why was your post directed only at Sweeney :(

It deserves to be ripped apart non-exclusively!



It was directed at Sweeney because he is far more intelligent then you Dragon. No offense by the way. He poses a threat to us religious crime fighters!

#1068 Sweeney

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:47 AM

Alright lets do this Sweeney.

First of all, answer me these questions:

1. Do you believe in Science?
2. Have you seen your Brain? If not, How do you know you have a brain if you haven't ever seen it?
3. What is the difference between the science you believe in, and the science in the holy quran? (excluding God for this statement. Meaning nothing to do with god, just science.)
4. Were there scientists on the earth 1400 years ago, and was there advanced technology?
5. You take a bio test from a teacher, she gives you time, but you don't study the material? Who's fault is it, you or the teacher? (providing she gave you the right material and plenty of time.)

Answer these questions for me in any order you want. Just make sure you answer them. And this is only to you. Not dragon or anyone else.

You appear to have ignored my request. Not a great start.

Regardless:
1) No. That's like saying "Do you believe in spanners?". Science is a tool used to discover truth, and I believe that science is the best tool for that job, as I have seen no evidence to the contrary.

2) Yes, I have seen my brain.

3) Science is a tool. Properly applied, it is the same everywhere.

4) There have been scientists since before civilisation. Advanced by what standard?

5) Mine, obviously. The difference, however, between a science test and religion, is that the teacher (analagous to God), the test (analagous to "living a pious life"), and the result (analagous to the afterlife), are all concrete, observable things, where as their counterparts are not.

Now, I hope you'll provide what I asked for?

#1069 Jake

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 03:58 AM


What I meant was to better your current life rather than live for a better after life or in some religions, a resurrection.

a) Tiger has proof on after life? Incorrect, if he proved in any way that was true, many more people would be religious.... thing is there isn't any proof about after life. Sorry for letting these lies escape and propaganda to 'taint' my mind, I'll just completely ignore a war that has been going on for 9 years. I will never find out mainly because I don't care about religion.

b) How can you tell me this if you are Islam? Most religions believe in after life, most certainly yours does... despite what you believe, I do not believe in an after life. I'm not saying religious is morally wrong, hell I would agree if anything it creates a more kind populous, the thing is and as you said yourself you are commanded to pray 5 times a day. If in anyway you must devote time and are forced to do things solely for a religion, that is when it becomes out of line. In my opinion it is the beginning of extremism.

I can live a better life than that by doing ALL of the things you mentioned ie charity, sports, community work etc. without having to spend any time with religion. Now by all means if that is what you believe in then you may do so, no one should tell you otherwise. The thing is I just don't see the reason on using my time to devote myself to a religion to better my after life (note this unless if there is another reason, because ultimately at the end you would just hope for acceptance by Allah into paradise.)

c) Your correct on this but also know that each own religion is like taking a class, you must devote lots of time to study it... most certainly Islam, if I spent all of this time studying each religion to fully understand it then it would defeat my own opinion of it in the first place. Sorry if I offend you by saying this but I think of it as a complete waste of time, regardless if gods exist I would deal with that when the time comes. In this game of chance, religious people bet to the gods, if they are right they would get a better after life... non-believers bet against some other forms, if they were right... they just saved a lifes worth of praying etc. In this case it's more reasonable to be religious, hell if you look at it from a glance it looks like the odds are stacked against non-believers. Even if I wanted to have faith, I could not because I just do not believe it. I was born a Christian, went to church every so often probably until I was 10, I don't remember a single thing from those visits simply because they do not interest me.

#1070 artificial

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 04:01 AM

It was directed at Sweeney because he is far more intelligent then you Dragon. No offense by the way. He poses a threat to us religious crime fighters!


I take brain supplements that boost my IQ by +50.

Im smart I tell you!!!

#1071 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 04:39 AM

Before we get into this whole discussion ladies and gentlemen.... all you religious people, atheists, agnostics, and pokemon lovers. I would like to state the weakness of Atheists. I have a theory. Atheists have 3 major weaknesses, when it comes to religion. This will ultimately lead to their downfall.


1. Assuming. ( This is the ability for them to jump to a conclusion fast, without thinking clearly or asking for more information. Asking for more information is good (seeking knowledge). It's safe and it keeps you from looking like a loser that doesn't know what they are talking about. Why would one be so anxious to answer, when they don't have enough information about the question.

There is a old saying " When someone's foundation isn't strong they are anxious to answer a question, even if they don't understand it? " How can one understand a question if they don't listen.

If he was truly a moral human, who was open minded, he would ask me to give him more information on the scenario. But that is the thing about Atheists folks. They question the beliefs of us Muslims, yet when we tell them something they don't listen to us. QUESTION NUMBER 5 is a great example of this. I ask him about a student that takes a bio test, and he automatically starts assuming that i'm referring to the teacher as GOD. He didn't even ask me, any information or detail, he assumed i was talking about something else. Sorry to burst your bubble Sweeney, but it has nothing to do with that. I just put it in there to see if you would ask for more information, or at the very least what the question has to do with the topic. The main point is the question was very vague, and you started talking about " What you think i was talking about" rather then what was in front of you.

2.??????
3.??????






You appear to have ignored my request. Not a great start.

Regardless:
1) No. That's like saying "Do you believe in spanners?". Science is a tool used to discover truth, and I believe that science is the best tool for that job, as I have seen no evidence to the contrary.

2) Yes, I have seen my brain.

3) Science is a tool. Properly applied, it is the same everywhere.

4) There have been scientists since before civilisation. Advanced by what standard?

5) Mine, obviously. The difference, however, between a science test and religion, is that the teacher (analagous to God), the test (analagous to "living a pious life"), and the result (analagous to the afterlife), are all concrete, observable things, where as their counterparts are not.

Now, I hope you'll provide what I asked for?


We will get to your request. In a second, i have to see these interesting answers first. So please bare with me. Lets dig deep into your answers a bit more sweeney.


1. Science is a tool used to discover the truth. Science is known for proving something is accurate or inaccurate. If people believe something maybe true, bring good ol science into the picture, and bam! It never fails in providing you with accurate information and proving that something is wrong or right. Do you agree with me so far? Yes or No?



2. You have seen your brain? Well butter my buns and call me buscuit...thats freakin unbelievable. But thats not what i was talking about. I am not talking about Xray images of your brain. I am asking if you have looked at your own brain with your own eyes. Which i think, is like impossible, unless your like a patient of dr.hannibal lector. So what you mean to say is, you have seen your own brain on xray, but you haven't actually seen the physical brain in your head. (just images of it) True or False?


3. Science is a tool, properly applied it is the same everywhere. So what your saying is when science is applied to religion , it does not change, it is the same science that you believe in and the same tool you use? True or False.


4. There have been scientists since before civilization. Okay fair enough let me rephrase this question. In the year 600, were there any scientists that grasped the knowledge of science we have today with detail? Yes or No



Stay Tuned for Weakness #2 and #3. By the way, i take your invitation after we are done this little discussion,Posted Image

Edited by Finale, 12 August 2010 - 04:53 AM.


#1072 Noitidart

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 04:46 AM

Laser our IP tools are not meant to be used in debates like that unless it was necessary. If he has a friend let him have some support, no one else is supporting him.
Finale please don't accuse Laser being a low life and enemies etc. "One of their Low life friends did a search on his pokedex". Our religion doesn't allow us to insult others like that.

Don't feel alone in your words. I support what you say, I see a lot of wisdom in it. But I'm not going to get involved with debates. But if Laser and Joe and Jake and whoever else are ganging up on you let me know I'll rawr at them.

#1073 Finale

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 04:49 AM

Laser our IP tools are not meant to be used in debates like that unless it was necessary. If he has a friend let him have some support, no one else is supporting him.
Finale please don't accuse Laser being a low life and enemies etc. "One of their Low life friends did a search on his pokedex". Our religion doesn't allow us to insult others like that.

Don't feel alone in your words. I support what you say, I see a lot of wisdom in it. But I'm not going to get involved with debates. But if you Laser and Joe and Jake are ganging up on you let me know I'll rawr at them.


Okay, I apologize Posted Image Islam doesn't allow it either.





hahahha ,ganging up? It's okay, their statements don't have much logic to them. They contradict in many areas. But thanks for the headsup

Edited by Finale, 12 August 2010 - 04:51 AM.


#1074 Noitidart

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 04:51 AM

No sweat I saw them gang on you and how Laser is misusing tools I installed for him!! Rawr laser rawr! :p

#1075 Jake

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Posted 12 August 2010 - 04:54 AM

Before we get into this whole discussion ladies and gentlemen.... all you religious people, atheists, agnostics, and pokemon lovers. I would like to state the weakness of Atheists. I have a theory. Atheists have 3 major weaknesses, when it comes to religion. This will ultimately lead to their downfall.


Please expand on downfall.


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